Status: FED
· Rillettes + Salad + Bread + Lentil/Beet/Sausage Salad
· Spaghetti Squash Carbonara: roast squash, poached duck egg, guanciale & jus
· Cassoulet
· Turtles by Zach
Had to do something with eggs as there were three types in my fridge: regular, duck and back-yard
This dinner took place on November 25th. So if people sent me thank-you cards (which Lily Cho and Hannah Sung are known to do), they are already filed in my archives, which open only for a Goldsbie freedom of information request.
Guest #: Jane Pyper
Occupation: City Librarian for Toronto Public Libraries
Contributed: Thirty Bench 2010 Riesling, Tawse 2009 Cabernet Merlot
Guest #: Vickery Bowles
Occupation: Head of collections for Toronto Public Libraries
Contributed: see above
Guest #: Hannah Sung
Occupation: Mother
Contributed: Corner Creek bourbon (fast becoming one of my favourite bourbons)
Guest #: Lily Cho
Occupation: Mother to be, of my godson, occasional professor
Contributed: Henry of Pelham 2009 Cabernet Merlot
Guest #: Zachary Green
Occupation: Baker, marathon runner, constitutional champion
Contributed: Turtles! He made turtles!
CITY LIBRARIAN: BOSS OF BOOKS
CHO
What’s it like to be in the press all the time as a librarian? Is this what you signed up for when you got your official librarian status?
PYPER
No. It isn’t.
What’s it like to be in the press all the time as a librarian? Is this what you signed up for when you got your official librarian status?
PYPER
No. It isn’t.
CHO
Because it’s pretty public.
Because it’s pretty public.
PYPER
It is very public.
It is very public.
CHO
It’s very political.
It’s very political.
PYPER
It’s probably, in my long career, the most public conversation about public libraries, I’ve ever experienced.
It’s probably, in my long career, the most public conversation about public libraries, I’ve ever experienced.
BOWLES
Which is great.
PYPER
Which is great.
CHO
Did you expect it? Or did it come out of the blue?
Did you expect it? Or did it come out of the blue?
PYPER
Uhm, “did I expect it?”
CHO
Did you mastermind the whole thing?
Uhm, “did I expect it?”
CHO
Did you mastermind the whole thing?
PYPER
No. I don’t think I expect its strength and its power.
No. I don’t think I expect its strength and its power.
BOWLES
Certainly after we amalgamated, the library, in 1998, all the sudden, the profile of the library became much bigger.
Certainly after we amalgamated, the library, in 1998, all the sudden, the profile of the library became much bigger.
CHO
But the library is also the new de facto community centre. So it became clear that people needed it more than just books. They needed all this stuff that the library offers.
But the library is also the new de facto community centre. So it became clear that people needed it more than just books. They needed all this stuff that the library offers.
Yeah, one of the things we talk about is that libraries are about books. But if you listen to the public conversation, all the deputation has referred, and all the testimony, people just talk about its meaning to their lives. And it’s much broader than that. It’s about computers and it’s about technology, community, public space. It’s about opportunity, and education. We haven’t told that story. They’ve told that story by just talking about what the library means to them. Which has been very heartening.
WHO SHUSHES THE SHUSHERS?
MINTZ
I’m at the library every week.
I’m at the library every week.
PYPER
Which one? Lilian?
MINTZ
Lilian. I work there.
BOWLES
It’s a beautiful space.
It’s a beautiful space.
PYPER
Lovely.
Lovely.
MINTZ
Gorgeous. I go up to the fourth floor, the VIP room.
Gorgeous. I go up to the fourth floor, the VIP room.
PYPER
We’ll put your name up there. “Corey Mintz VIP Room.”
We’ll put your name up there. “Corey Mintz VIP Room.”
CHO
You have no idea, if the shirt didn’t already tell you.
You have no idea, if the shirt didn’t already tell you.
MINTZ
You’ll talk to that guy in the corner office about the yackety-yak on the phone, given that he is attendant to the reading room, the VIP room.
You’ll talk to that guy in the corner office about the yackety-yak on the phone, given that he is attendant to the reading room, the VIP room.
PYPER
I’ll make a note. Too much yackety-yak?
I’ll make a note. Too much yackety-yak?
MINTZ
(brushes hands clean) My job’s done. That’s all I wanted.
(brushes hands clean) My job’s done. That’s all I wanted.
CHO
You are a rat.
You are a rat.
MINTZ
I did say something already.
I did say something already.
PYPER
How did that go?
MINTZ
Well I was nervous. Because I …
Well I was nervous. Because I …
PYPER
Negotiating public space is always tricky.
Negotiating public space is always tricky.
MINTZ
Here’s how it went down. I’m in the reading room. I’ll go on a Monday morning to do my transcription with my headphones on. There are always other people there. They’re usually quiet. The guy in the corner office is on his phone and he’s really talking loudly. And I thought, can you shush a librarian?
Here’s how it went down. I’m in the reading room. I’ll go on a Monday morning to do my transcription with my headphones on. There are always other people there. They’re usually quiet. The guy in the corner office is on his phone and he’s really talking loudly. And I thought, can you shush a librarian?
PYPER
The answer is no.
The answer is no.
MINTZ
No? Because the internet said otherwise.
No? Because the internet said otherwise.
PYPER
Did it?
CHO
You looked it up?
MINTZ
I tweeted it. I tweeted that question.
GREEN
Who shushes the librarian? That’s the question.
Did it?
CHO
You looked it up?
MINTZ
I tweeted it. I tweeted that question.
GREEN
Who shushes the librarian? That’s the question.
MINTZ
Several people got back to me, including, I think, a librarian or two.
Several people got back to me, including, I think, a librarian or two.
PYPER
Is he actually a librarian or is he our settlement worker?
Is he actually a librarian or is he our settlement worker?
MINTZ
I do not know the gentleman’s title.
CHO
Ok, but for the layperson, anyone working in a library is a librarian.
Ok, but for the layperson, anyone working in a library is a librarian.
PYPER
That’ll be the next public conversation.
That’ll be the next public conversation.
MINTZ
Well the word that came back was, “absolutely, you should go and tell another librarian.”
Well the word that came back was, “absolutely, you should go and tell another librarian.”
PYPER
Did you?
Did you?
MINTZ
I did. I tried to use my least-snitchy voice.
I did. I tried to use my least-snitchy voice.
CHO
That must have been hard.
That must have been hard.
MINTZ
It was. Because I was definitely ratting this guy out. I went to someone who sees me on a weekly basis, enough to say hello. And I said (whispering), ‘I don’t know if this is acceptable for me to say, but the reading room, to my understanding, is a quiet space.’
It was. Because I was definitely ratting this guy out. I went to someone who sees me on a weekly basis, enough to say hello. And I said (whispering), ‘I don’t know if this is acceptable for me to say, but the reading room, to my understanding, is a quiet space.’
GREEN
That’s your least snitchy voice?
That’s your least snitchy voice?
PYPER
Commentary welcome.
Commentary welcome.
MINTZ
Well I didn’t have a toothpick in my mouth, shifting back and forth.
Well I didn’t have a toothpick in my mouth, shifting back and forth.
CHO
So what happened?
PYPER
Yeah, what did she say?
MINTZ
She said something like, (whispering) “You’re not the first person to say something about that”.
So what happened?
PYPER
Yeah, what did she say?
MINTZ
She said something like, (whispering) “You’re not the first person to say something about that”.
PYPER
Well that’s good. Active listening.
Well that’s good. Active listening.
MINTZ
And she said she’d look into it. And I think later that day, another librarian came to tell me that something would be done about it.
PYPER
Something can be done or something will be done?
MINTZ
MINTZ
Something had been done.
GREEN
The Star gets action.
The Star gets action.
PYPER
So that was when?
MINTZ
This would have been a few months ago.
So that was when?
MINTZ
This would have been a few months ago.
PYPER
And what is the outcome?
MINTZ
I have not heard a peep from him. But I have since been emboldened to have shushed some other people.
And what is the outcome?
MINTZ
I have not heard a peep from him. But I have since been emboldened to have shushed some other people.
PYPER
You’re like a shusher gone wild.
You’re like a shusher gone wild.
MINTZ
And I want you to understand that this goes in stark contrast to my regular attitude, which is, I am not saying anything because I don’t want to get stabbed.
And I want you to understand that this goes in stark contrast to my regular attitude, which is, I am not saying anything because I don’t want to get stabbed.
PYPER
Right. In the Lilian H. Smith reading room.
Right. In the Lilian H. Smith reading room.
MINTZ
Well, in movie theatres I’m thinking of. I’m new to the libraries. I know the movie scene and in the movie scene I feel like there are always people talking and on they’re on their phones and it’s very frustrating and they’re diminishing your …
Well, in movie theatres I’m thinking of. I’m new to the libraries. I know the movie scene and in the movie scene I feel like there are always people talking and on they’re on their phones and it’s very frustrating and they’re diminishing your …
PYPER
Here’s what I want you to do Corey. I know it’s around the corner. But you should do a library tour. Do your transcript at the reference library. It’s a beautiful space.
Here’s what I want you to do Corey. I know it’s around the corner. But you should do a library tour. Do your transcript at the reference library. It’s a beautiful space.
MINTZ
It’s gorgeous. It’s a schlep though.
It’s gorgeous. It’s a schlep though.
PYPER
I know. Schleps are good.
I know. Schleps are good.
MINTZ
Schleps are good. But …
Schleps are good. But …
CHO
Isn’t this your era of working out and fitness?
MINTZ
But. But. I love working at the library.
Isn’t this your era of working out and fitness?
MINTZ
But. But. I love working at the library.
CHO
Yes?
MINTZ
But I like going to the bathroom at home.
Yes?
MINTZ
But I like going to the bathroom at home.
EVERYONE.
AHHHH.
CHO
I understand that.
I understand that.
PYPER
Maybe if we got you a staff key.
Maybe if we got you a staff key.
MINTZ
Hey-Oh!
PYPER
There are almost no perks to the library. But that’s one of them.
Hey-Oh!
PYPER
There are almost no perks to the library. But that’s one of them.
MINTZ
Now I feel good about putting some effort into this meal.
Now I feel good about putting some effort into this meal.
It may seem from this transcription that Hannah didn't say anything. She did, plenty, when we discussed children's books. But I didn't transcribe that part because I was more interested in bathroom talk.
PUBLIC VS ACADEMIC LIBRARIES
CHO
The librarians of the university are in this moment where they’re juggling the very visible part of their work and the really urgent demands of the invisible, or the less visible, parts of their work. And they’re under a lot of pressure because, at least the professoriate has a long history of doing invisible, obscure work. People still get down on them about it, but it’s slightly less …
BOWLES
Let’s say public librarians and academic librarians have different orientations, don’t you think?
PYPER
Absolutely.
Let’s say public librarians and academic librarians have different orientations, don’t you think?
PYPER
Absolutely.
CHO
Yeah. What do you think the biggest difference is?
Yeah. What do you think the biggest difference is?
PYPER
Public libraries are about, they’re oriented towards community and the broad public —kids, adults, seniors — connecting them with what they want, whether that’s a book or a program or a place to study. It’s much more focused on that connection.
Public libraries are about, they’re oriented towards community and the broad public —kids, adults, seniors — connecting them with what they want, whether that’s a book or a program or a place to study. It’s much more focused on that connection.
CHO
So in order to be a public librarian, would and MLIS degree even make sense?
PYPER
Well you’d have to have it. but I think the big complaint, they say the big complaint is, that it’s not very well suited, to public libraries, as we would like it to be. So it’s more suited to this justification of the professionalization of the degree, than it is to what we want people to come out with.
Well you’d have to have it. but I think the big complaint, they say the big complaint is, that it’s not very well suited, to public libraries, as we would like it to be. So it’s more suited to this justification of the professionalization of the degree, than it is to what we want people to come out with.
CHO
Interesting. And is there any kind of conversation between public libraries and MLIS programs?
Interesting. And is there any kind of conversation between public libraries and MLIS programs?
PYPER
Yes. Come in this month. A new dean. But you know, academic settings — I’m not telling you anything — are driven by demand and commercial. They’re also interested in who’s hiring what they’re training for. And plus, I think that they suffer from that “it’s not really a profession unless we make it more rigorous” kind of …
Yes. Come in this month. A new dean. But you know, academic settings — I’m not telling you anything — are driven by demand and commercial. They’re also interested in who’s hiring what they’re training for. And plus, I think that they suffer from that “it’s not really a profession unless we make it more rigorous” kind of …
CHO
Right. Law school.
Right. Law school.
PYPER
Feeling. So they have more of the things you’ve identified. Where as we’d probably like it to have more about communicating with people and community development, children’s librarianship and understanding about connecting books with young readers.
Feeling. So they have more of the things you’ve identified. Where as we’d probably like it to have more about communicating with people and community development, children’s librarianship and understanding about connecting books with young readers.
CHO
Or non-English readers.
Or non-English readers.
PYPER
Absolutely.
Absolutely.
BOWLES
And a broad understanding of classic literature.
And a broad understanding of classic literature.
Do you think the issue then, is that public libraries aren’t necessarily going to be the biggest employers of future MLIS grads so they have to be … ?
PYPER
I think that’s what’s driven them in the last little while. Two things. One, that they sort of have to credentialize themselves to the university and the academic community. And secondly, where their job market is. But the interesting thing is, even in academic libraries now, people talk about these things. So in some ways the themes are the same. collaborative learning and creating learning spaces and connecting people with resources. So maybe it will correct itself a little bit now.
LIBRARY CAP & TRADE
CHO
I can’t put this coherently. But generally I’m anxious about the weight of stuff. For example, we’re about to move and it’s very important to me now that we never acquire anything ever again, including books. And I’m a PhD in English lit. I’m nothing but books. But I think we cannot buy any more.
I can’t put this coherently. But generally I’m anxious about the weight of stuff. For example, we’re about to move and it’s very important to me now that we never acquire anything ever again, including books. And I’m a PhD in English lit. I’m nothing but books. But I think we cannot buy any more.
PYPER
That’s what a library’s for.
That’s what a library’s for.
CHO
I think we have to go to the library. Yes. Or we have to do cap and trade. If you bring a new book into the house, an old one has to go, or some system.
I think we have to go to the library. Yes. Or we have to do cap and trade. If you bring a new book into the house, an old one has to go, or some system.
PYPER
Mmm. Cap and trade.
Mmm. Cap and trade.
CHO
But what does the library do? I mean, there are more books being published every year. At some point, you must run out of space and I actually felt guilty …
But what does the library do? I mean, there are more books being published every year. At some point, you must run out of space and I actually felt guilty …
PYPER
I thought you wanted us to make you feel less anxious.
I thought you wanted us to make you feel less anxious.
CHO
I remember having this huge debate with one of my colleagues. I said, I’m all for e-books. Does my book actually need to kill trees and take up another slot on the physical shelf when only 100 people will ever read it in the course of the next 70 years. And surely it should just exist in some ephemeral platform and not take up too much space because I see how many books get published in a year and libraries are the place where most of them get bought. Where do they all go? I actually felt worried for you.
I remember having this huge debate with one of my colleagues. I said, I’m all for e-books. Does my book actually need to kill trees and take up another slot on the physical shelf when only 100 people will ever read it in the course of the next 70 years. And surely it should just exist in some ephemeral platform and not take up too much space because I see how many books get published in a year and libraries are the place where most of them get bought. Where do they all go? I actually felt worried for you.
PYPER
Book heaven. I’ll just alleviate your anxiety. They go to book heaven. It’s an interesting point. Because there’s sort of a ‘books as sacred objects’. People don’t have a problem taking their stuff to Value Village, that it either goes to a dump or somebody uses it. But they don’t feel that way about books. They feel that they have this important …
Book heaven. I’ll just alleviate your anxiety. They go to book heaven. It’s an interesting point. Because there’s sort of a ‘books as sacred objects’. People don’t have a problem taking their stuff to Value Village, that it either goes to a dump or somebody uses it. But they don’t feel that way about books. They feel that they have this important …
CHO
You can’t just throw out a book.
You can’t just throw out a book.
PYPER
Which is fabulous.
Which is fabulous.
MINTZ
You can always give it away. But you cannot dispose of a book.
You can always give it away. But you cannot dispose of a book.
PYPER
That’s right.
That’s right.
CHO
We looked at the shelf this morning. I said to Zach, ‘What Shamoo Taught Me’. That does not belong on this shelf.
We looked at the shelf this morning. I said to Zach, ‘What Shamoo Taught Me’. That does not belong on this shelf.
PYPER
What Shamoo Taught Me?
CHO
He bought it. I didn’t.
What Shamoo Taught Me?
CHO
He bought it. I didn’t.
MINTZ
I’m still sitting on my copy of ‘I Was Hitler’s Cat’.
I’m still sitting on my copy of ‘I Was Hitler’s Cat’.
PYPER
(motioning to my tiny bookself) Well you’ve definitely …
(motioning to my tiny bookself) Well you’ve definitely …
MINTZ
I’ve slimmed down.
I’ve slimmed down.
PYPER
In more ways than giving up bread.
MINTZ
Hey-now. I want this answer. But I’ll tell you what I did. My bedroom was downstairs. When I moved upstairs, this bedroom has angled walls and no space for bookshelves. All my books, and comic books obviously …
Hey-now. I want this answer. But I’ll tell you what I did. My bedroom was downstairs. When I moved upstairs, this bedroom has angled walls and no space for bookshelves. All my books, and comic books obviously …
CHO
Obviously.
Obviously.
MINTZ
Which comprises most of my books. They all went into boxes and they’re in my closet. Except for food books.
Which comprises most of my books. They all went into boxes and they’re in my closet. Except for food books.
CL
So why do you keep them in your closet? Why don’t you just give them away?
So why do you keep them in your closet? Why don’t you just give them away?
MINTZ
(pause) They’re books.
(pause) They’re books.
CHO
See?
See?
PYPER
They’re sacred. Sacred objects.
CHO
See, we have these solutions. But the library doesn’t.
See, we have these solutions. But the library doesn’t.
PYPER
Have you ever heard of compact shelving.
Have you ever heard of compact shelving.
CHO
Yes, I have. But at some point you’re going to run out of compact shelving. I don’t even know how many thousands of books get published every year.
Yes, I have. But at some point you’re going to run out of compact shelving. I don’t even know how many thousands of books get published every year.
PYPER
There’s a magical network of books. We as a public library, our mandate generally, to answer you very prosaically, is not preservation. I hate to tell you this.
There’s a magical network of books. We as a public library, our mandate generally, to answer you very prosaically, is not preservation. I hate to tell you this.
CHO
I can take it.
I can take it.
PYPER
Books are for use. There are five laws of libraries. One is ‘Every book its reader’ and another is ‘Books are for use’.
Books are for use. There are five laws of libraries. One is ‘Every book its reader’ and another is ‘Books are for use’.
CHO
So if something doesn’t circulate in, let’s say eight years, what’s the limit?
So if something doesn’t circulate in, let’s say eight years, what’s the limit?
PYPER
Should we tell them the truth?
Should we tell them the truth?
CHO
I totally want to know. When does a book have to go to book heaven.
I totally want to know. When does a book have to go to book heaven.
PYPER
But here’s the thing. The magical network of public libraries are all about connecting books and people. Academic libraries have a different mandate. And the national libraries and the special libraries …
But here’s the thing. The magical network of public libraries are all about connecting books and people. Academic libraries have a different mandate. And the national libraries and the special libraries …
CHO
I worry about the national libraries.
I worry about the national libraries.
PYPER
That’s where they go. That’s book heaven.
That’s where they go. That’s book heaven.
MINTZ
I thought there was a room marked Fahrenheit 451where there was just a guy with a flamethrower.
I thought there was a room marked Fahrenheit 451where there was just a guy with a flamethrower.
PYPER
No. There’s a book heaven.
No. There’s a book heaven.
CHO
So basically, you download the problem. You offload the problem.
So basically, you download the problem. You offload the problem.
PYPER
We don’t consider it downloading. We consider it sharing.
CHO
So you’ve made it Ottawa’s problem. That’s a genius way of dealing with municiple-federal relations.
So you’ve made it Ottawa’s problem. That’s a genius way of dealing with municiple-federal relations.
We’re uploading.
Dude, Zach MADE these turtles.
Date of publication: January 14th, 2012
1 comments:
I could have saved a lot of dough if I knew that everyone who works at a library was known as a "librarian."
Saw you on CityNews(?)giving lessons on shovelling.
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